Welcome Judge......Let us school you on the ways of the dark side....
Hobo
Hobo Ken
JoinedPosts by Hobo Ken
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116
Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall
by Hobo Ken inthis is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.
he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.
this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.
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Hobo Ken
Bttt
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36
DF or DA what do you think the difference is?
by Rosey ini would like to know from everyone first of all what they think the difference is between a df'd person and a da'd person.. i would also like to know what everyone thinks that jw's think is the difference between a df'd and da'd person.. personally i am df'd.
i was df'd 10 years ago almost and did not argue it at all as i had no desire to continue as a jw anyway.
before being df'd i was always under the impression that if a person da'd themselves it almost always meant they were " apostate" and that there was no way a jw should have any contact with them.
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Hobo Ken
>sweetpea
Well said.
Matt
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36
DF or DA what do you think the difference is?
by Rosey ini would like to know from everyone first of all what they think the difference is between a df'd person and a da'd person.. i would also like to know what everyone thinks that jw's think is the difference between a df'd and da'd person.. personally i am df'd.
i was df'd 10 years ago almost and did not argue it at all as i had no desire to continue as a jw anyway.
before being df'd i was always under the impression that if a person da'd themselves it almost always meant they were " apostate" and that there was no way a jw should have any contact with them.
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Hobo Ken
>Besty
That was the passage of scripture I left them with to read in their own time at the end of my Judicial appeal.
I also like the fact it mentions a "faithful steward" who would only be such if he did not act in the way the scriptures warn against in this verse. This is exactly the judgemental way the Watchtower and it's henchmen behave in complete oppostion to Paul's words.
Faithful and Discreet......I think not.
Matt.
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36
DF or DA what do you think the difference is?
by Rosey ini would like to know from everyone first of all what they think the difference is between a df'd person and a da'd person.. i would also like to know what everyone thinks that jw's think is the difference between a df'd and da'd person.. personally i am df'd.
i was df'd 10 years ago almost and did not argue it at all as i had no desire to continue as a jw anyway.
before being df'd i was always under the impression that if a person da'd themselves it almost always meant they were " apostate" and that there was no way a jw should have any contact with them.
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Hobo Ken
>Rosey
Good comeback to Reniaa there. As usual a post without a punch (and off topic) She seems to think that both groups could get back in as both are out in the spiritual darkness so therefore it does not really matter how we categorise ourselves......She like many Witnesses does not even begin to contemplate a life outside of "God's Org." To an extent she is right , both groups are no longer JW's so what does it matter how they got there?
Rosey as far as I'm concerned anyone who has left the wts is ok in my book whether they have been kicked out or left of their own accord.
Of course there are things which the Bible says are wrong but the Bible also says we are not placed to judge others as we are all sinners.
This is a good passage of scripture.(1 Corinthians 4:2-5) . . .Besides, in this case, what is looked for in stewards is for a man to be found faithful. 3 Now to me it is a very trivial matter that I should be examined by YOU or by a human tribunal. Even I do not examine myself. 4 For I am not conscious of anything against myself. Yet by this I am not proved righteous, but he that examines me is Jehovah. 5 Hence do not judge anything before the due time, until the Lord comes, who will both bring the secret things of darkness to light and make the counsels of the hearts manifest, and then each one will have his praise come to him from God.
Here the so called "judicial committe" is laid bare by the scriptures and we are counselled not to Judge until the Lord arrives because he is the only competent Judge.
I'm absolutely no different from anyone else that's left. Because I choose a Christian course does not make me better than those who have not, in fact it should make one more humble and realistic about all of our failings.
I have many friends of which I count you among who are exJW and they are all in very different circumstances but all fellow humans.
The organisation seeks to control and enforce punishment on it's members by disfellowshipping, even for things nowhere mentioned in the Bible. How can that be love for your neighbour?
There is not a day goes by that I'm not glad I left this organisation.
Matt.
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36
DF or DA what do you think the difference is?
by Rosey ini would like to know from everyone first of all what they think the difference is between a df'd person and a da'd person.. i would also like to know what everyone thinks that jw's think is the difference between a df'd and da'd person.. personally i am df'd.
i was df'd 10 years ago almost and did not argue it at all as i had no desire to continue as a jw anyway.
before being df'd i was always under the impression that if a person da'd themselves it almost always meant they were " apostate" and that there was no way a jw should have any contact with them.
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Hobo Ken
How about this for the difference between DF'd and D.A.'d,:-
DA'd person has made a concientious and informed decision to leave the wts whatever the reasons.
D'F'd person could be one who has been DF'd for non Biblcal "sins" like apostasy etc but it's usually the case that it's some act like adultery or drunken-ness.
How about this for an extra dimension though, anyone seen the 6th sense? Bruce Willis's character is dead but does not realise it. When he eventually gets hit with the news it's a complete shock.
I believe that there are a significant number of people who were disfellowshipped over the years that don't realise what they have actually left behind. In other words they still think it was the "truth" and God's big old organisation on earth. Perhaps they've had no contact with any "apostates".
Imagine the shock when they are told or find out what it really is they left behind.
I make a point of finding those who are in this position locally and making sure they know the score (if they didn't already).
A disassociated person to some degree or another has recognized that they want no part of the Watchtower Society.
Matt.
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116
Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall
by Hobo Ken inthis is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.
he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.
this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.
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Hobo Ken
>Flipper
Ty.
>I knowall
Russel was a deluded, power crazed ,self important blasphemer. What he had to say about ex members was laughable.
The realisation that you have been conned, for pehaps in some cases, all of your life by the Watchtower Society is what drives many ex members to take action against what they used to hold dear.
I personally would like this organisation to completely disintegrate. I work hard at what I do now to get people out and prevent others from joining. If even one person in each category took positive action then I will have been succesful in my course.
So what if they don't like it and attach some labels to me I don't care what they think of me .
It was liberating to tell Ronnie Hunter what I thought of him and that I was no longer going to follow his fallacious organisation but that he was welcome to do so for the rest of his life.
Matt.
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116
Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall
by Hobo Ken inthis is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.
he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.
this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.
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Hobo Ken
>Judge
It's weird Judge that is exactly the same experience as I had. For years my old man refused to accept the "new light" because he wanted to believe the old light more. Now he doesn't teach it in the min but said he still beleives it!!! Amazing . Technically he is an apostate....
I had a discusion with both my folks recently in which I said we were all guilty of false prophecy and teaching lies to people regarding the generation ,whether unintentional or not. There is no excuse.
The 1914 dogma is an embarrassing doctrine and hangs like a millstone round the WtS's necks. The problem the G.B. have is they have so heavily pushed it and in fact built thier whole organisation on it that it is going to take a genius peice of P.R./political spin to back away from it.
>Boyzone
It's great that happned for you although the mind has to be right and I think you do have to be a smart person and receptive to the Holy Spirit for it to happen.
This is an interesting scpiture which I think pertains to this scenario:
(2 Thessalonians 2:9-12) 9 But the lawless one's presence is according to the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and portents 10 and with every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth that they might be saved. 11 So that is why God lets an operation of error go to them, that they may get to believing the lie, 12 in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness.
There are some for whom these verses apply in the JW org. They believe lies as taught by the Watchtower and refuse to believe the actual truth as found in scripture almost like as the above verse said they take pleasure in believing bad lies.
I have shown close family members verses like Rev 19.1 which plainly says the great crowd are in heaven NOT EARTH( as the wts teach) and they actually don't accept it. I've seen the prophecy in this verse in operation.
Or my brother Paul during podcast 7 "I know what you say about the society becoming an NGO, but I just don't accept it "
Don't accept what Paul? that they didn't do it or that you don't want to accept that your beloved organisation could do such a thing?
Boyzone you were receptive but some will believe this crap until their dying day. Password believes that some people have to be "broken" before they will change their mind. Who knows with Ron and his number 2 , Paul?
Matt.
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116
Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall
by Hobo Ken inthis is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.
he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.
this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.
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Hobo Ken
Let me give you an example of the mentality of Ronnie Hunter he said to me " I have absolutely no doubt that the Kingdom was established in 1914"
Paul Barrie" the kingdom being established in 1914 is a cornerstone teaching, it will never be changed"
There must have been people like these two back in the day who believed that Christs presence in 1874 was an equally immovable object in their faith.
Now I would ask , if you have conditioned your mind as much as these two that something is an immutable fact and will never be anything but what happens when the organisation changes it ? They will eventually discard 1914 or more likely downgrade it's importance. They are already doing it ,in my view with their 1919 appointment dogma.
When this happens what effect will it have on men like these and their confidence in the organisations teachings?
The organisation's fanatics like Ron and Paul will be slapped in the face by their own Governing Body.
People like us won't even have to lift a finger.
Matt
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116
Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall
by Hobo Ken inthis is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.
he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.
this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.
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Hobo Ken
I think that given the memorial was a few months ago it's wierd how he's still going on about it in the middle of June.
I mean why not "look at the assembly coming up in a few weeks", or even use the meeting that night as a stark contrast between tthem and the world.
I wonder if given the fact he falsely testified about my views on the memorial and who should partake (when I hadn't even discussed it with him) whether this is evidence that it's on his mind a lot. The usual witness mentality is to look forward to the next bountious spiritual provision not back in the calendar.
Ironically he used to work for a company called provident.......